Tarcisius asks:
Regarding your requests:
I am currently able to legally purchase and own a, to my limited knowledge, vast array of firearms.
As for my current and likely future geographical makeup, I live in a relatively flat, plains-like area surrounded by small mountains. There are a few larger towns on the plains bleeding out into more rural areas in and near the mountains. I am in one of the smaller towns, but about a 10 minute drive away from the woods and potential retreat locations with friends/family/fellow church folk.
With regards to firearms, I intend to use them for hunting and defense. The more adaptable a given firearm is to multiple scenarios, the better. This next bit may be asking a lot, but some type of cost-to-own ranking would be helpful for a given weapon. For example, if you recommended having a shotgun, what is your best recommendation? But also, what is an “okay” alternative if one is strapped for cash because he has a family to support and feed? Additionally, what models or manufacturers should be avoided entirely? I was recently gifted a Winchester SXP shotgun. Is it a good gun to keep?
Do you have any recommendations for gaining weapon familiarity that don’t involve spending money on ammunition and gun range visits?
Thank you, G.
Let’s get the quick parts done first. The Winchester SXP has many variants, but they are all decent. In fact I own a Winchester SXP Defender myself (the pump action one) and I would put it as a top class gun. Are there more expensive ones? Sure, fancier ones? Sure. But a shotgun is a shotgun at the end of the day and a 7+1 pump shotgun is really one of the best guns you can have. you can hunt anything from birds to smallish buck or even boar with it if slugs are permissible in your area. And it’s under $400 so will not break the bank. Plus, a pump shotgun is about the best home defence weapon you can have. Load it with buckshot and the chances of a bad guy surviving a centre mass hit at home defence distances are tiny.
If you can only afford one long gun, after the shotgun you already have I would suggest a RUGER SFAR in .308 with the 20″ barrel.
Why this particular gun?
Here are the bullet-points:
- It is light for the calibre it fires so is an excellent compromise of hard-hitting round yet carry-ability is high even if you have to hike around a while with it.
- Why .308 instead of .223? Because with .308 you can reach out to 1000m with some training and will do 600-800m hits with just some basic marksmanship. There are many other advantages, not least of which is that getting hit by a .308 spoils your whole day a lot worse, comparatively than a .223, all else being equal.
- Ruger rifles perform incredibly well out of the box. Although my own rifle is not a SFAR, it does 1/2 MOA out the box (if you don’t know what MOA is don’t stress, you can study that up at leisure).
- For the price (around 1500 $ or less I believe) it is the best compromise of a long range gun that can also be used up close if needed. it is semi-auto so can be fast, and .308 are basically 7.62 NATO rounds so cheap and available everywhere.
- Why 20″ barrel instead of 16″ because it makes a difference for long distance shots and if you live in a plains type set-up 1000m is really a minimum in case of having to defend an area.
- Shove some decent PASSIVE only scope on it. If you can still find them, Leupold used to make awesome mil-dot scopes with starlight ability, you can illuminate your reticle by shining a light into it and you will see the main posts inside the reticle without giving away your position to special night vision equipment (though the rest of you probably will if you are not shielded in some way). You don’t need huge levels of magnification, in fact, a variable scope say 4x to 15x or something like that is probably ideal on that type of rifle. You can go for more, say 6x to 20x or whatever, but your field of view at that higher magnification is very reduced.
- Get some training on it and range it out to 500m and get to know how much of a hold you need to have for different distances and practice, practice, practice. If you shoot a thousand rounds after having been properly trained and having understood the basics, you will already be able to score reliable one shot hits at 500m without problems. If you are talented, out to further.
So that is what I would recommend on a budget. The SFAR with decent glass will be your biggest expense but it will be your everything gun and you can hunt anything in the USA with a .308.
if you are concerned about self-defence then you should also get a handgun and carry it on you (obviously with all relevant permits) and train pretty obsessively with it. The amount and variety of handguns available is almost infinite so get thee to a range and practice, practice, practice with LOTS of different guns until you find one you like and that works for you.
Ultimately every other consideration after:
- Having it on you, and
- Being comfortable and accurate with it
is a distant second consideration, including calibre and everything else.
Some reliable polymer thing in 9mm is probably the most common and versatile type of handgun, although, personally, I can’t bring myself to say Glock without throwing up in my mouth a little, but that’s down to personal preference.
If on the other hand money were no object, on a plains type of landscape I personally would prefer a .338 Lapua. I would get it in the Ruger Precision Rifle format. HOWEVER, that is because I KNOW that with a .338 Lapua and some practice I can reach out to 2000m fairly reliably. and I can make anything up to 1400m fairly easy to kill on first shot and pretty much anything within 1000m is screwed. BUT The Ruger RPR is a HEAVY rifle and once you add decent optics on it (for a .338 Lapua you want the big magnification, at least x20 but even x30 or more is not a bad idea) sling, bipod and so on, you’re not going to be running around with it easily, especially if you have a decent load of ammo with it (say 100 rounds minimum in a SHTF scenario).
And .338 Lapua ammo is NOT cheap and not that easy to find either. So this kind of rifle is really a hunting rifle that in a SHTF scenario becomes a very plausible and dangerous sniper weapon in the right hands.
An alternative is .300 Winchester Magnum instead of .338 Lapua which you can still do 1000m shots a lot easier and more reliably than using a .308 and can reach out to 1400-1500 m if you train and get it right.
Even then, assuming a .338 Lapua was no objection, I would still have the SFAR in .308, because even as a sniper buddy team, the SFAR is a decent rifle and far more likely to be in your hands in any given day, since the .338 Lapua begins to approach crew-served weapon size/weight/usability.
I hope that covers your most pressing questions.
One thing I cannot emphasise enough is:
GET PROPER TRAINING FOR LONG DISTANCE SHOOTING
and practice as much as you can.
I tend to use only match ammo and don’t bother reloading because I don’t have the time to devote to it, but if you have the time and reload you can save some money. With match ammo in .300 WM you can comfortably hit at 1000m reliably if you practice regularly. doing it in .308 requires a level up in terms of proficiency.
If you have any further questions or clarifications please post a comment on this post and I will reply to it.
Tags: guns, rpr, ruger, the kurgan
This is a bit of a stream of consciousness so here goes:
Excellent advice from G. I wish we were closer. I would enjoy LRF-ing your battlespace, shooting and fellowship.
My brief adds: Get quality magazines. No Magpul. Go Lancer hybrids with metal feed lips. Sling: Vickers sling at Blue Force Gear. Its a rifle holster. Learn iron sights first. He can add a simple light 3x Burris or Vortex red dot optic for shooting 7-300 yards. Paul Howe doctrine (see below). For pistol, just get more of the manufacturers mags only. Do buy quality if you can. Buy once, cry once.
“Do you have any recommendations for gaining weapon familiarity that don’t involve spending money on ammunition and gun range visits?”
If someone helps set this young man up correctly, he can do lots and lots of dryfire practice – for free – to improve his skillset and learn to call his shots. (Where was the reticle dot when you very carefully pulled the trigger?). Key points: He needs someone to set him up from scratch with a robust, simple (relative) system that works across weapon system platforms. First is safety. I suggest he read Paul Howe’s “The CSAT Way” for basic familiarity and Much more at Paul’s website http://www.combatshootingandtactics.com. Call his office and ask for any trainers in your area. See if you can do a distance learning. He has a Patreon site for shooters to learn as well. He is in the top ten basis points of trainers in the US. Former delta force. KISS principles. Very articulate and mentally squared away. You can find more vids of Pauls training at Panteao: https://www.makeready.tv/en/watch/instructor/details/paul-howe/13
Review all this material before buying equipment.
Gunbelts: thebeltman.net – you want steel core leather belts for stiffness.
Holsters: https://dalefrickeholsters.com/
For the room broom (shotgun), training/books by Tom Givens, Gabe Suarez, Rob Haught are top. Bill Jeans if you want to go back a bit in time. Once he has a basic shotgun shooting skill, he needs to pattern his shotgun and find the slugs which work best in his gun. Shotguns differ. The best shot is Federal Tactical Flight Control 00 buck. Patterns the tightest due to the proprietary flight control casing/wad. For slugs, lots of brands. Start with Brenneke KO.
Shotgun:
https://www.makeready.tv/en/watch/instructor/details/bill-jeans/26
https://sym-tac.com/
https://www.makeready.tv/en/watch/instructor/details/louis-awerbuck/61
https://www.makeready.tv/en/watch/instructor/details/wes-doss-phd/34
Long range: Instruction videos:
Long range Parallax removal dryfire training aid: https://www.dstprecision.net/index.html (good for you too G)
Distance correct miniaturized targets for dryfire practice: https://intrepidtactics.com/long-range-pistol-targets/
You can further miniaturize the above targets yourself to simulate longer distance.
In the strongest of terms I most strongly suggest the young man invest in a tremor 3 reticle for his scope when he is ready for long range. Horus makes cheaper scopes with this reticle. Nightforce ATACR 4×16 is the expensive gold standard. Just get the reticle , accuracy first DVDs and learn how to use the wind dots on the tremor 3. They are wonderful for shooting in wind. Simulator here: https://www.horusvision.com/reticle-simulator#Try%20TREMOR3%20Reticle
https://www.accuracy1st.com/
Call up Paul Howe to develop a training program for yourself for handgun/rifle. Call Tom Givens, Rob Haught, or Gabe Suarez (suarez international) for a shotgun training program. And when your ready for long range, call up Accuracy First and speak with Todd, his son, or Pete Gould. They will square you away. Long range is a Big skillset to learn. Did I mention get a long range optic with the Tremor 3 reticle? You might consider learning handgun first since you can carry that all the time, then rifle from 7-100 meters. Then reach out.
I really cant stress enough how important it is for this young man to get top quality training so he sets himself up correctly from the start. This is an investment in himself. He can start slowly with shotgun videos and phone calls. He can do lots and lots and lots of dryfire without shooting rounds, then go test at the range with an instructor to confirm/change/tweak technique, modify, etc. This is most efficient. He is on the right track not wanting to waste money at the range right now.
Best to you and your family, son.
TT
Probably too much info in one go, but fair enough, though I am not familiar with the people you recommend. The point is:
1. do not get overwhelmed, remember that 95% of everything is BS so just focus on getting good with what you got and figuring out what is the best you can get with what you have.
2. There is a LOT of information you can get for free on the internet and if you find a decent trainer, then by all means take a course with them for the thing you want to improve, but never forget to figure things out yourself and experiment and test for yourself.
My book on close quarter combat highlights this specific point, about knowing things for yourself, but it applies to all of life. Figure out what works for you.
Thank you, Tex. You really cranked open the information fire hose here.
I also want my sons to learn firearm proficiency and safety. My oldest boy is 7. Is this something he can learn alongside me, or would you recommend getting myself squared away first, at least with the basics, before teaching him?
Learn the basics yourself first. A young boy looks up to his dad and you don’t want to give him the impression you don’t know what you’re doing, as it will make him less sure. Not that I mean you should ever lie to him about your proficiency, if my son asks me something I don’t know I say so and I then learn about it with him to show him not knowing is not a problem, but not figuring it out is. But with guns it’s best if the sense of importance/safety/correct handling is as close to absolute and complete from the start. (nothing ever is, but our brains look for “certainties” automatically and it’s best if those first impressions are based on solid foundations of competence and reality).
Thank you, sir. This is exactly what I was hoping for! I have no further questions for the time being. It appears I have some studying to do.